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Junior Member
 
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| Oh boy, a mystery! I'm a wildlife biologist - but as a bat specialist I'm out of my league with coydogs. I would guess that Mart is right - the differing breeding cycles and social structure would seriously hamper the chances of breeding. I believe most coyotes would rather eat a dog than breed one. But I can probably get a pretty definite answer for us. My friend and neighbor is the state Furbearer biologist and an avid trapper. I'll see if I can pick his brain about coydogs and let you know what he says.
Muddy Run Farm -- clean floors are highly overrated
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Senior Member
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Of course their are Coydogs...haven't any of you read the ending of Call of the Wild? (LOL)
All joking aside, I have heard of coydogs here too, but have never seen one. Its probably possible that they have crossed with a feral dog, but like Mart I have never heard of any scientific proof this occurred.
The one thing I have heard about coyotes and breeding is that when their numbers are low, they simply have higher litter counts to compensate. I am not sure how they would know the density of the coyote population in a given area, but that was what I was told anyway. So if that does hold true, then hunting them heavily would only mean you control the population for as long as you can keep the hunting pressure up. If you have a lot of anti-hunter neighbors moving in, or you get a deep snow like we did a few years ago...you get this explosion of coyotes.
Personally I think livestock owners have a hatred for coyotes based entirely on fear instead of statistics and making decisions based on emotions is never a good idea. Coyotes don't go after lambs because they love the taste of lamb...they go after lambs because its easy food. The harder a livestock owner makes it for the coyotes to get to the animals, the less incidents he will have. You can do that in a number of ways...from using high quality fencing, guard animals, hunting or any combination thereof.
A lot of it depends on your location too. 4 goats are not going to have the same smell, sounds and size as a 400 goat operation, and statistics prove the closer you are to a waterway, the more likely predators follow that waterway. And of course keeping the animals grazing near houses will help too. I am sure there are a number of reasons why we have never had a sheep killed by a coyote here, while in other parts of the state the predator loss is high. But I think a person with livestock should find out what the predator loss ratio is in their area before they fear the coyote and want them removed entirely from an area.
I love vegetarians...slice them real thin, dip them in ranch dressing and they compliment lamb quite well! :-)
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Starting Member
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Last Login: 11/22/2009 9:08:02 AM
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for years PA Game Comish denied any exsistance of coyotes in PA. they told us of an over population of wild dogs. This turned out to be a bucket of crap and lies after the population blew up big time and "the coyote" lady started to shoot a 'yotie a week from her home close to me.
The State of PA had allowed the yote to establish it's self in part to control deer were hunters are few.
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| As promised, I got a for-real answer from a for-real wildilfe biologist. The short answer is no coydogs - for the reasons we talked about (social strucutre and timing of breeding don't match). The occasional one may occur but it is insignificant at a population level. In short, they are more myth than reality (at least here in the east). Mart, I have the latest scientific paper that analyzed the genetic structure of nearly 700 eastern coyotes and found that significant breeding ocurred with Canadian wolves as the cocyote popn arced north of the Great Lakes. This hybridization is what allowed them to colonize PA and other eastern states so quickly (beginning in the mid 1940s). That hybridization also transformed them from the small mouser of the Great Plains to the larger deer hunter of the eastern woods. As far as coydogs, the paper states: "Likewise, our finding of only one dog-like haplotype suggests that hybridization with dogs has not been significant, at least not between male northeastern coyotes and female dogs." Mart, I think you would find this paper fascinating. If you'd like to see it, let me know and I'll PM it to you.
Muddy Run Farm -- clean floors are highly overrated
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Starting Member
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I would love to read that paper. I have heard the theory of the wolf/coyote cross breed and the resulting larger coyote in the east. The largest coyote I ever caught in Northern New York was 52 pounds. In the west my largest coyote was 36 pounds. I don't trap much any more but still love to research and gain knowledge. Please do PM the information. Thank you.
Mart
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Starting Member
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the coydog idea was domestic dogs and yoties. not yotie and wolf.
the idea I follow is that the northeasteren Coyotie has evolved from a blood line that went north into canada following trappers and prospectors and then moved east over a centurie. our yoties are larger than those I've seen in other parts of then country. They are all coyotie and have 0 wolf blood. BUT it's not out of the question to think that the northern yote is larger due to his environment.
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| Williams: You said in an earlier post that you are a wildlife biologist specialising in Bats. I would be really interested in you starting a post sharing you knowledge on attracting bats, stuff they like and dont like, best places for batboxes, designs of bat boxes etc. I have a really decent colony of bats but would love to help them increase numbers and make life a little easier for them! obviously in return I expect to be completely mosquito free next year !!!
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Starting Member
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"Williams: You said in an earlier post that you are a wildlife biologist specialising in Bats."
if this is the case, have you meet my mother in law?
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Junior Member
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| Britboy. A post on bats? That's a good idea. Duh, wonder why I hadn't thought of that? With White Nose Syndrome, bats need all the help they can get these days. Maybe over the weekend when my T-giving obligations are done, I'll start a post on attracting bats to the hobby farm. WOS. Don't know how to answer your question without knowing your MIL's name. Mart. I'll double check to make sure I can distribute the paper. I just noticed it has a Dec 09 publication date, which means it is still 'in press'. That means I may not be able to send it to you until it appears in the official journal. So if there is a delay, please remind me in a week or two and I'll send it to you. I know you'll enjoy it.
Muddy Run Farm -- clean floors are highly overrated
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your might actually think I was being real... ha ha... as if she actuality worked with bats/was in your field. or that she actually worked
when I talk about "the old bat" that's her name. LOL 
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