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Starting Member
Group: Forum Members
Last Login: 11/16/2009 7:11:34 PM
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| The idea that government is protecting farmers and consumers from the free market is ludicrous. The government uses taxes and subsidies as tools for their social engineer agenda. If the government was really interested in helping farmers, they would remove the petty restrictions placed on farmers, and let farmers farm. Some farmers would fail. Food prices would probably rise some. But the net result would be a stronger farm economy for a majority of farmers, and more realistic food prices.
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Starting Member
Group: Banned Members
Last Login: 11/16/2009 12:13:08 PM
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| why brit...well I would not espect you to understand since, you didn;t grow up doing It, If we lost the farm I'd probly ponder suicide. that's not to be morbid. but can you understand what this is all about? we loose money but we feed you. that is why. Why do soldiers risk there lifes for people who knock them? same concept. I thought you were a business starter brit???? do you just start businesses and let the government write you checks? this is called capitalism please try to wrap your mind around it. I know how you do it over seas but this is a place were you do it on your own.
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Starting Member
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Last Login: 11/16/2009 12:13:08 PM
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| here is the point if this is a mag for hobby farmers, then don't write about real farmers your out of your juristdiction.
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Starting Member
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Last Login: Today @ 5:50:53 AM
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| Britboy, China is communist if I recall and yes the gubment supplies everything the people need for the most part. Just like they are trying to do here but the American people are free to choose and the free market has always been our way of life. Not perfect but better than anything else so far. Ken
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Starting Member
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Last Login: 11/16/2009 12:13:08 PM
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I also would like to make this point, now that many seem to see my point of virew and the only one who thinks this is much about nothing is Brit, who is from the UK and....why did you come here???
I make other choices that, wile they may not make a diffrance in the markeet per say, make a statement that others in my area may also beleave in. I.E.Don't bring any non-dairy butter or cheese in my home. I took some from a guest and tossed it in my lawn once to make the point.
I'd list others but making my voice known via the net and makeing an example in my own home should show people around me how I live and the more of that there is, perhaps the better life will be.
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Senior Member
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Last Login: Today @ 8:55:34 AM
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Everyone knows that I will take a farm subsidy if it suits what I am trying to do on my farm, but I completely agree with you on this WOS. Its just money be sent to a problem to say they are working on a fix. Its how politicians deal with things...they deal with money so they give money out.
The bank bailouts
The take over of the automakers
The heath care reform
Its all just money being unjustifiably thrown at the issue. The problem is, when you toss money at corporate america, whether it be banks,insurance companies, automakers or even farmers, greed will set in and the ones that are able to gobble up the majority of it, will do so. This is where the inexperience of our president comes into play. He honest too goodness thought giving banks bailout money would work. Well that is NOT how wall street operates. They are greedy people who live to make a buck any way they can. They took the bailout money and did just that. There was not too many conservative minded people that did not see that coming.
Just as there was better ways to deal with that issue then giving out billions of dollars, there are better ways to help the farmers help themselves. Deregulating the dairy industry would be a very good first start. It is pretty bad when the dairy industry hired a arithmetician with a phd in mathematics and he can not even figure out how the price of milk in the state of Maine is set. I'll leave you the link on how it is figured out just in case you think such confusion is necessary in the dairy industry!
Shutting off the flow of imported milk into this country would be another start, and if they really want to help local areas, stop the flow of milk from crossing the milk regions already set up. Let the milk prices reflect what it actually costs to produce milk in any particular area. Not that is a novel idea huh?
We probably won't see a dime of that 350,000 million bucks. But then again we have never seen a dime from farm aid either. As WOS says, the greedy will get the money and not the farmers that truly need it!
Eat lamb...because 50,000 coyotes CAN'T be wrong!
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Senior Member
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Douggifford (11/5/2009)
The idea that government is protectingfarmers and consumersfrom the free market is ludicrous. The government uses taxes and subsidies as tools for their social engineer agenda. If the government was really interested in helping farmers, they would remove the petty restrictions placed on farmers, and let farmers farm. Some farmerswould fail. Food prices would probably rise some. But the net result would be a stronger farm economy for a majority of farmers, and more realistic food prices.
Mr Gifford, let it be known that I fully agree, and that I always love to see your name on this forum. You have excellent insight and reply with some well meaning stuff that I have always enjoyed reading. You have my deepest respect!
Eat lamb...because 50,000 coyotes CAN'T be wrong!
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Starting Member
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Last Login: 11/16/2009 12:13:08 PM
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| Draw, like many farmers, you view subsity as ok becouse your fellows have the same views. however it's time to just reject them and let the chips fall as they may.
anything a government brings for free is going to come with a price.
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Junior Member
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| You all say you would like to be left alone by the Gov, and the point I am trying to make is that if you were left alone you could not compete with the price of imports. The time it would take for you to fail is equal to the time it takes for other places to crank up production. The price example I used earlier concerning corn is true. If the Gov dropped import rstrictions which for your info are placed to "protect agriculture and industry" and dropped the inport duties so that the foreign producers have a level field then corn would be available here within a few years at prices the farmers here wouldn't get out of bed for. The question you people should be asking is WHY? instead of whining about how bad things are for you. I have never taken a penny from anyone to start my businesses, I wouldn't lower myself. In fact last year I paid almost 1/4 million dollars in taxes to Fed/IL. My business is unique in this country, If I left this country the US would need to import my products. I have never even taken out a business loan, I finance my businesses myself and I take the risk myself. I am here to get rich and then I will go home. And when I say rich I mean really rich. Please dont commit suicide, this is a discussion. I know China is communist and I know America is capitalist Mr G, I dont understand what this has to do with whether the US consumer has free market access to cheap food. BTW, whilst I live in the US I am almost fanatical about buying US made products if I have that option, I am sometimes critisised by my own US citizen employees for "spending there bonuses" by buying more expensive US made stuff. I live in this economy and whilst I am here I will support it as much as I can, When I go and live either in Eng (my home) or in another foreign country I will support that economy.
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Senior Member
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As Paul Ewing once said, "it often comes down to definitions", and I think that is the case here. WOS and I, and perhaps a few others are not in the chase for the almighty dollar, we saw the futility of that many, many years ago. In fact with the economy the way it is, I see more and more people seeing that chasing the DOW has cost them their souls. Instead WOS and I differ in that we are merely trying to hang on to the family farm of which we are lucky enough to be handed down.
For the longest time on here I had a quote of my Uncle as a signature. It was this: "When it is all said and done, and the coffin goes in the ground, it is the farmer that is the richest man of all." Now I believe this is true and on two fronts: Financially speaking and rich in life.
On the latter, we live a wonderful life. Great-grandchildren, Grandchildren, Parents, Aunts, Uncles, Brothers and Sisters all coming and going on the farm. That right there is a deep richness beyond belief. So is having your child raised by those very same people and eating food and livestock raised right on your own land. It truly is an occupation that is community based and wholesome in every way.
On the former...fiscally speaking that is, it is even more true in terms of being rich. Land, timber, crops, livestock, fencing, buildings and equipment all have incredible values...more then you could imagine when you add it all up. I know you and many others that are takers and not givers would not understand this, I had an opportunity at 33 years old to sell out.
I was working on the yard when a white van pulled up and 12 people showed up wearing bonnets, suspenders and black hats. They were the Amish and they stayed 30 minutes asking about how many arable acres I had, how many acres overall and all that. I told them as its no secret here. I knew they were asking everyone in the county who had over 100 acres of land if they would sell. We talked farming for a bit and then the offer came...3.2 million. I didn't even think about it, "Its not for sale". It was fun thinking about what I could do with that much money, but it was just fun thoughts, I know better then to take the money and live the rest of my life saying, "I used to own..." Nope, I live the good life now and could die tomorrow without a regret.
I know you don't understand this, materialistic people never do, but WOS and I are not searching for anything, we simply want our children to have the same opportunities as us. We complain and whine because despite our passion, and hard work, the system does not fairly apply across the board because at the current time, the government wants cheap food. We love what we do, but NO ONE likes being taken advantage of. That's all.
Eat lamb...because 50,000 coyotes CAN'T be wrong!
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